[css-text] Clarify importance of writing system as well as language for lang-specific effects #2015

fantasai · 2017-11-29T03:44:29Z

https://www.w3.org/TR/css-text-3/#languages notes that typographic effects vary by language but should also mention writing system, and should give examples like ja-latn to emphasize that UAs need to detect script tags. See https://twitter.com/little_potato/status/935608512297820160

frivoal · 2018-10-04T08:09:36Z

@fantasai I wonder if this edit is actually sufficient. Shouldn't we also change bits of text like that in the definition of the line-break property, which say things like "do FOOBAR if the content language is Chinese or Japanese", and instead make them say "do FOOBAR if the writing system is Chinese or Japanese", liking to the text that c983ca6 added to point out that the writing system should be assumed to be that of the content language, unless the author has said otherwise?

If we don't do that, it seems to be that the text you've added, while a great explanation of the situation, isn't actually invoked properly from the rest of the spec.

frivoal · 2018-10-04T08:10:42Z

Reopening, so that the above comment doesn't get lost. We can close again if there's nothing to be done, but I'd like to make sure.

frivoal · 2018-10-09T00:42:19Z

But can we actually say "if the writing system is Chinese"? Chinese isn't a writing system, so it seems we should we instead say something like "if the writing system is one of Hans / Hant / Hani / Hanb, or the language is Chinese and the writing system is unspecified". It would be nice if we could drop the second part of the sentence, but it's not clear to me that the mapping from languages to default writing-system for that language is fully defined, and if it isn't, then we need that second clause.

frivoal · 2018-10-09T01:41:28Z

Then again, the above introduces a direct dependency from css to iso15924 writing system tags, instead of leaving the specific way to encode these to the document language. So maybe we should speak of "the Chinese writing system", rather than "one of Hans / Hant / Hani / Hanb"…

acli · 2018-10-09T02:14:21Z

Since I was the one making the original complaint, I should first apologize for not joining in the discussion, but I think I need to make it clear that my issue was not specific to the Chinese writing system. I did observe the problem while marking up Chinese, but I can’t see how this isn’t going to affect other languages that can be written in multiple scripts (basically anything that’s not written in the Latin alphabet).

I just cobbled up a minimal test:

<!doctype html>
<html lang=en>
<head>
<meta charset=utf-8>
<title>Test</title>
</head>
<body>
<p>
This is a sentence with a Chinese word, <span lang=zh-yue-latn>ping4 on1</span>;
an Arabic word, <span lang=ar-latn>salaam</span>;
and a Hebrew word, <span lang=he-latn>shalom</span>.
</body>
</html>

I have not tried overriding any styling yet, but with default styling all the three non-English words are being displayed using a different font (on Firefox Nightly 64.0a1) even though they are all “latn”. This doesn’t look like something specific to the Chinese writing system to me.

Closes w3c#2015

frivoal · 2018-10-09T03:43:55Z

Alright, I've made a pull request that attempt to deal with this. It's quite possible I didn't get it write on the first attempt, but it's a start.

@fantasai, feedback very much welcome.

Closes w3c#2015

Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015

frivoal · 2018-10-09T08:14:58Z

Made some tentative tests to go along with that spec pull request: web-platform-tests/wpt#13430

Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015

Closes #2015

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <git@florian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: f3cb0265f0c1de2b76f36205c6735e5203dd7a67

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: 2cf194f546b2f3818e7f79b4e13bb0cc4e5f37cc

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: f3cb0265f0c1de2b76f36205c6735e5203dd7a67

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: 2cf194f546b2f3818e7f79b4e13bb0cc4e5f37cc

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: f3cb0265f0c1de2b76f36205c6735e5203dd7a67

…stem dependent rules, a=testonly Automatic update from web-platform-tests[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015 -- fix typo Co-Authored-By: frivoal <gitflorian.rivoal.net> -- Merge pull request #13430 from frivoal/writing-system [css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules -- wpt-commits: 60e792e88bf7e2839b584354b128600bb89a7e8f, 643c8394abb53fbca39590728bc30ad96b1feb6c, 9b65752bd8f279c76532401268f06250ac5d479c wpt-pr: 13430 UltraBlame original commit: 2cf194f546b2f3818e7f79b4e13bb0cc4e5f37cc

fantasai added css-text-3 Current Work i18n-tracker Group bringing to attention of Internationalization, or tracked by i18n but not needing response. labels Nov 29, 2017

fantasai added the Tracked in DoC label Mar 6, 2018

fantasai closed this as completed in c983ca6 Mar 23, 2018

fantasai added Closed Accepted by Editors’ Discretion Needs Testcase (WPT) labels Mar 23, 2018

frivoal self-assigned this Oct 3, 2018

frivoal reopened this Oct 4, 2018

fantasai added the Needs Edits label Oct 9, 2018

frivoal added a commit to frivoal/csswg-drafts that referenced this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text-3] Disentangle content language and writing system

3954981

Closes w3c#2015

frivoal mentioned this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text-3] Disentangle content language and writing system #3202

Merged

frivoal added a commit to frivoal/csswg-drafts that referenced this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text-3] Disentangle content language and writing system

c2bdb4f

Closes w3c#2015

frivoal added a commit to frivoal/csswg-drafts that referenced this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text-3] Disentangle content language and writing system

c14fe8b

Closes w3c#2015

frivoal added a commit to frivoal/wpt that referenced this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules

3e9d921

Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015

frivoal mentioned this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules web-platform-tests/wpt#13430

Merged

frivoal added Needs Review of Test Case(s) Needs Review of Proposed Text and removed Needs Edits Needs Testcase (WPT) labels Oct 9, 2018

frivoal added a commit to frivoal/wpt that referenced this issue Oct 9, 2018

[css-text][css-fonts] Testing writing system dependent rules

60e792e

Related to w3c/csswg-drafts#2015

frivoal closed this as completed in #3202 Nov 15, 2018

frivoal added a commit that referenced this issue Nov 15, 2018

[css-text-3] Disentangle content language and writing system (#3202)

1d4b0a1

Closes #2015

frivoal removed Needs Review of Proposed Text Needs Review of Test Case(s) labels Dec 26, 2018

frivoal added the Tested Memory aid - issue has WPT tests label Apr 25, 2019

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[css-text] Clarify importance of writing system as well as language for lang-specific effects #2015

[css-text] Clarify importance of writing system as well as language for lang-specific effects #2015

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[css-text] Clarify importance of writing system as well as language for lang-specific effects #2015

[css-text] Clarify importance of writing system as well as language for lang-specific effects #2015

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